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Pod, Actually
A podcast about people's favourite podcasts.
Pod, Actually
Felix ❤️ In Our Time
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In this episode of Pod, Actually, Felix, a public speaker and moonshot strategist living in London, talks about his favorite podcast: In Our Time. This is a show that can spend an hour on the sun, mitochondria, or the Sri Lankan revolution and somehow leave him feeling steadier, cleverer, and more interested in being alive. Which is no small thing.
🎙 Felix's Top 5 Podcasts:
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Hello, I'm Catherine and welcome to Pod Actually, a podcast about people's favorite podcasts. On today's program, I'm speaking with Felix. Felix is a public speaker and moonshot strategist based in London. Let's jump in. Felix, what is your favorite podcast?
SPEAKER_02In Our Time on BBC Radio 4.
SPEAKER_00This is In Our Time from BBC Radio 4, and this is one of more than a thousand episodes you can find in the In Our Time archive.
SPEAKER_01Please tell me a little more about In Our Time.
SPEAKER_02So In Our Time has been on for gosh, it feels like decades. I can't don't really know how long, but it's must have been 20 years. And it was presented by a chap called Melvin Bragg, who has been a TV presenter of very learned shows, very learned art shows in the UK. And he's a novelist, figure novelist actually as well. And he's created the show which is a one-off, but it's beautiful. It's actually the new host, is Misha Blenny, because Melvin Bragg's quite old. And the show take is very much like an Oxbridge tutorial where you have Melvin Bragg, or in this case now Misha Blenny, and they'll pick a topic, and it may be, for example, the sun. The sun. And he'll get three guests in. And they'll all be very, very heavyweight intellectuals. So there'll be a professor from Oxford, a lecturer from Manchester, whatever, you know. And they're always very heavyweight. And they each walk Melvin Bragg, as if he's a bit of an idiot, through everything he needs to know about, say, the sun in this case. And I say the sun because it's my favourite every episode. I mean, it's just full of facts that has your jaw on the ground. But what's really good is it's really interesting because they walk into it very carefully. So you are led by the hand. You know, Richard Feynman, the great Nobel Prize winning physicist, did a wonderful thing once. He said, if you can't explain something to an eight-year-old, you don't understand it. And that almost feels like the premise of this show. Could you explain this to an eight-year-old? But what's really wonderful is that the show very cleverly takes you deeper and deeper and deeper. He takes you by the hand, and he's very much the advocate for the listener. So it starts very simply, but then like a sort of Oxford Don, he just gently probes his guests and he challenges and pushes at them. And it's just a joyous journey every time he leaps into feathered dinosaurs, it might be Brunel, it might be uh the American Civil War, it might be the Sri Lankan Revolution. It uh covers history, science, economics. I I can't think of a subject, uh an academic subject, it doesn't really cover in some shape or form. And there's over well over a thousand episodes, which you can just go on, just listen on the BBC net. And they're just all fascinating. And it's and it you know, and you get the occasional episode where it might be an author where you go, I can't stand the author, so that's the only reason I'm not going to listen. But actually, 98% of the time, it's gold. It's gold, and it's very it's always full of factoids that has your jaw on the ground and fascinating. And you feel cleverer at the end of it. You think I've learned something there, and I've really enjoyed myself. But it's incredibly convivial. It's incredibly, you feel like you're eavesdropping on a tutorial, Oxford, you know. And it's it they they just they just perfect it. And Misha Glenn's been a wonderful new host. He's been really good, and he's picked up the reins. Uh, and he's a very, very good presenter himself. Again, very personal, very uh charming. So and it's just wonderful. So it's all it's very seek, it's very quietly a heavyweight thinking show that brings you in by the hand in a really lightweight approach where you don't, you know, you never lose your weight. It takes you to the labyrinth of thinking, and you never lose your weight. It's like it's like there's a ball of thread you all the whole time. You never worry about getting lost. So there you go. That's that's my my joyous choice of in our time. And I love it. And if I'm on road trips, if I'm on a flight, uh, I always download some because I'm I'm never going to be disappointed. Never. And also it reminds you there's so much white there that you didn't know that you didn't know. You know? And it's so many subjects where you go, I didn't know that uh the air the air was once mainly iron and the oxygen has only been there for about a billion years, whatever it is. What was so how did that work before that? And they'll tell you, and they'll tell there's an episode on death where by the end of it you're convinced that no one really dies. But not for spiritual reasons, for biological reasons. Because neither math can neither be created nor destroyed. And and it takes you into what happens to her body when it dies, and when you go, hang on, we don't die, do we? We just we become diff different life forms. It's incredible. It's honestly it's it's a it's a mind-expanding, idea-challenging show, and I love it. And it's done it's done very beautifully.
SPEAKER_01And how long is each episode?
SPEAKER_02It's about an hour. Actually, what's really charming is if you listen to it live, well not live, but as it as it's broadcast because it's on radio four, I think it's about 50 minutes. But if you listen to the podcast episode, there's always a bonus bit where the the m the show stops, and then Melvin Braggle, now Michigan, say, Right, I've got there's some questions I didn't get to. Do you mind if I ask them? And you can literally hear everybody sit back in their chair. And it just there's a nice shift in mood. It's very, very charming. And that's often the best bit. It's like, oh, I wanted to hear that bit as well. In fact, funny, what he normally says that when the once the uh the recording has stopped, he says, Okay, which bit didn't we get to that you wish you had? And there's a bit of a bun fight where there's oh god, how do we not talk about Queen Victoria doing this or or this this this Velaraptor or whatever? And that goes on for about 10 minutes, and then someone comes in with tea, and and Melvin Bragg or Misha Glenn says, Oh well, someone's arriving with tea now, it's over. And again, it's all part of the charm, it's a very English show. And I think in the same way that I'm not a cricket fan, but I've got friends who, when they travel, put the cricket on because they say, I haven't left home. If I hear the cricket, I haven't left home, and it's very it's a very English show. But in a world where we live on 10-second Instagram videos, to have a show which is languorous and gentle, and it's like if the lacking of the sea was a radio show, this would be it.
SPEAKER_01But mind expanding.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, you do. You feel like I said, you feel clever at the end.
SPEAKER_01So this portion after the recording is strictly for the podcast.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, which makes the podcast even more of a little gem. You know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because it's quite intimate. You feel like now it's just just the four of you sitting there chatting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and it you you feel even more brought into the room. It's very lovely. It's very lovely and intimate. And what's not as well is the pretense of the of the broadcast goes. So it's you know, it's very much obviously everything's been rigorously it's very well researched, all these things. But at the end, it's suddenly off script. And it's really lovely to hear them going off script and just having a bit of a think, you know. Very nice.
SPEAKER_01And is that available for all listeners? Or do you have to be a paid subscriber to get access to that?
SPEAKER_02In the UK, it's free. I don't know what access people have internationally to BBC Radio. So the iPlayer, BBC iPlayer, I think if you just tell it, you give it your email address and say, Yes, I am a licensed pair, you're you're in pretty much.
SPEAKER_01So anyone who's listening to the podcast will get that little insider segment at the end.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah, absolutely. And it's and it's beyond charming. It's beyond charming. And like I said, it's a rare show you're just not fascinated by. The show on mitochondria, and you go, Why do I want to listen to a show on mitochondria? And by the end of it, you say, How did I not dedicate my life to mitochondria? It's the most interesting subject. It's that good. It's that good.
SPEAKER_01How often does this show drop?
SPEAKER_02It's weekly, and I would say for about certainly a third of the year. So yeah, maybe half the year, yeah. And like I said, there's over a thousand episodes in the bank, and they're all worth going through. Yeah, I it's not a show where you say, Oh, it gets good in 2000. It was good from the beginning.
SPEAKER_01They must have quite the team working to be able to put out such a comprehensive program every week.
SPEAKER_02Do you know what you realize? You it's seamlessly done. But what happens when you listen to enough? You go, oh, okay, I see the formula here. They're each of the guests, like I said, who are who've earned their spurs, uh, they're they're either academics or people who really you you have deserve a place in academia. That might be a leading author or maybe a leading diplomat or something, but typically academia. They each clearly script their part, but then clearly that's also gone through the production team's hands and Melvin Bragg's in charge of it, or measure Glenn these days. But what it what you've sensed is how thoroughly they've done it, how carefully, and this is why it's such a clever show because everything leads on to the next thing. It isn't kind of okay, we'll cut touch on this theme. No, we're gonna go to this theme. No, it isn't. It's just beautifully. I I can't imagine anyone spending six months trying to do a better uh structure to the show because it isn't gonna happen. They just nail it. It's such a pleasure.
SPEAKER_01Do you have any rituals that you enjoy when you're listening to the programme? Do you go and make a cup of tea when they make a cup of tea? Do you always listen in the morning? Do you always have to be wearing your slippers? etc.
SPEAKER_02Do you know what it is? It's my it's my show when I don't have to feel guilty about downtime. So I when I travel, I'm not very good at living with the dead time of travel. But equally my concentration goes. I'm not great, I don't want to write essays or anything or whatever it is I want to do when I'm traveling. But I don't want to just listen to nonsense or watch a I don't want to watch films necessarily on a flight. So for me it's my travel companion.
SPEAKER_01So do you save them up or do you listen as soon as the show drops, but then when you're traveling, you dip back into the catalogue?
SPEAKER_02I don't track the broadcasting at all. There's so many in the catalogue. It hasn't occurred to me to try and keep up with it. So for me, I am constantly cherry-picking, like The Night's Templar or Saturn's Moons. I'm seriously, there were there were complete episodes on Saturn's moons. And you just learn so much. So I'm never going to be disappointed, you know. Uh so it's it's whimsical, but always it's but it's my travel podcast.
SPEAKER_01So you're not aware of what day of the week the new episode dropped? I don't think I am. No.
SPEAKER_02No, I don't think I am. I should I should be more tuned, especially as a guest. I should should have done a bit of homework. But no, no, if you see me going through an airport with headphones on, I'm listening to an outtime. But that's when they drop.
SPEAKER_01And I guess one of the joys of the program is it is essentially timeless.
SPEAKER_02Well, that's it. And it is, in fact, you make a really good point there, is that they don't try and root it in the news or events. It's very much a detached look at a topic. And in fact, I think you and again, you do, yeah, you make a very good point there. I hadn't really thought of this. There's a buffer between the show and now. They do not have things about the last five years. You might have someone talking about neutrinos, and then someone says, Oh, recently in CERT and they've done this experiment. But that's the only reason that we've come into it. It's not a show that cares about really trying to bring things up today. It's meant to be a comprehensive introduction. Or overview, maybe.
SPEAKER_01You explained when we started talking that Melvin Bragg was the longtime host, but that they've recently retired and now it's Misha Glenier. But from the way you talk about the programme, clearly your sense of the identity of this show is still very much tied to Melvin Bragg.
SPEAKER_02Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01How long has it been since he retired?
SPEAKER_02I think it's less than a year. So I was with him for about 25 years. So that's a long time. And the thing as well is, and and younger people may struggle with this, but just you just have to accept this is the truth. When you're young, you don't appreciate education. And when you get older, you just wish you could learn so much more. And you know, every person I know whose kids have flown the coop and all those things, all we want to do is learn. All of us. It's like, what are you learning? You know, and I've got friends who go back to university, but all of us are reading books and reading more factual books and fiction books all the time. And this is my fix. This is my I need to learn about that. And and in the fast-paced world, it's so nice to slow down and learn something slowly. I think we're all guilty of whipping through online articles and all these things. And I think Melvin Bragg's pace is wonderful to me. And there's just honestly, there's hundreds of episodes I haven't listened to with that Melvin's done. So I keep an eye on Misha Glenny. And so if he if he suddenly popped out and did one on Jane Austen, I'd have to listen to it. But actually, for the most part, there's so much I need to listen to from uh Melvin Bragg that yes, you're absolutely right. You've identified my my uh my but my emotional bond.
SPEAKER_01Well, I was going to ask, what would it take for you to bond with Misha Glenny?
SPEAKER_02Uh exhausting Melvin Bragg's back catalogue.
SPEAKER_01So when you when you think of this show, you do think of it in relation to Melvin Bragg?
SPEAKER_02I do, although Misha Glenny's very good. So actually I I do keep half an eye on it. Um and I and I I'll I'll morph over to it. I'll morph over to it because he's he's you know he's uh and and he gets to do things again. I don't mind if he wants to cover the same subject.
SPEAKER_01How much of your enjoyment of the programme is about your respect for the host?
SPEAKER_02Probably quite a lot. I think I mean he's not a saint. Some episodes he gets on my wick. Some episodes I think he can be a bit rude to people. Oh and I think yeah, and I think he's oh I think back in the day, I think he could have been slightly more respectful to the female guests. That's my interpretation for legal purposes. But I felt there were times when I felt uncomfortable and I thought, hmm, you know, and I think I think there were times actually I took a bit of a break, I got a bit annoyed, to be honest, seriously. But then he became flawless, I think, after that, after eventually. But yeah, I think he was a bit uh I did find him a bit irksome for a while. So I don't actually think it's the same, but he's just so good at what he does, and no one else was doing it. And it's the kind of the BBC at its best. Because the BBC is so good at generating new comedy, new drama, but it's so good at educational shows. And yeah, and you know, for of us I'm sure the world knows how beloved the BBC is when marching the streets for it. Uh, we do love it. Thankfully we haven't got the media landscape that everyone loves so much in America.
SPEAKER_01It sounds like Melvin also learned some lessons along the way.
SPEAKER_02I think he did actually, because he never made that mistake again for the second half of the series. But I do remember hearing some early episodes and being a bit my nose was out of joint. Because he's very old school. You know, and I mean though he's in the he's in his eighties now, so I mean he does come from a different time, uh, which doesn't give anyone a pass, but I do, I I don't need to I'm not I'm not can't I'm not uh into cancelling it, but you can still raise your eyebrows and go, come on out do. So he's it's he was he was in that territory for me.
SPEAKER_01If someone had never heard a podcast before, is this one that you would recommend?
SPEAKER_02In a heartbeat.
SPEAKER_01Yeah?
SPEAKER_02In a heartbeat, yeah. It's when I look at my podcast stats, this is comfortably the one I've listened to the most. I mean comfortably. And uh I mean is this then what's it Pod Save America would be the second one. And then again, then the third would be a distant third. So, but no, but this is comfortably. I honestly it might be this as much as all the others put together it, because there was a period a few years ago where it just gorged on it because it's just so much to listen to. Yeah, and so I know I'd recommend this to anybody. You know, yeah, I really would. I really would. Because like I said, part of the fact is fascinating, you feel cleverer at the end of it, and it it rekindles your joy of learning if it was ever gone.
SPEAKER_01Have you ever pretended to like it less than you do?
SPEAKER_02No, I'm the real deal. What you see is what you get. Uh no, uh it's it's because the thing is it's not mainstream huge success or anything. So you don't have to s you don't have to take a uh a stance, you don't have to be uh uh snob about it, and you don't have to be embarrassed by it either way, you know. I tell what as well, there's a lovely thing, isn't there? Where someone people say, look, don't ask people what's their favourite book, ask them what's the book you've gifted most. And that's a really lovely way to really get to the bottom of what book do you really love. And so mine's in Darthur by Herman S. You know, comfortably. I give it to anyone, anyone in strife to get a copy of this book. And interestingly, I was thinking about this the other day because I did it again, but In Our Time is the show I've I've easily sent the most episodes of. We'll be talking about Japan. I was like, oh my god, have you have you heard about the Sokoku period of Japan? And my friends are going and they're gonna know oh my god, well, the in our time to do this episode, you have to listen to it, you know. So I and my daughter's doing astrophysics, so the poor thing has had so many episodes sent to her because it covers, oh Lord, I mean, about a hundred hours. Thankfully, she digested it very quickly. But uh, but yeah, yeah, so so uh it is, it's the show I give the most. And funnily enough, even if I don't think of an episode, if I'm talking to a doctor or a lawyer, whatever, I can easily just Google, you know, search for it inside the BBC and I'll find well, and so there's always something to send for a bit of a laugh, you know.
SPEAKER_01Final question. Do you think liking in our time says something about you? And if so, what is that?
SPEAKER_02I don't think there's anything wonderful that can be said that hasn't already been said. I mean, it's you know I think I'm intellectually curious. You know, I I know what Socrates knew is that I know nothing. Seriously, and I'm not being modest. I mean, I know a grain of sand on the beach. There's so much knowledge out there. So I think if if it says something about it, it speaks to my curiosity. I'm wildly curious about other people, about things I don't know about. And I think it says that I think in the UK, yeah, if you're down a pub, someone might raise their eyebrow, maybe, but really everyone's I think quite interested in what everyone else is doing. And it's so I'd be certainly my peers, no one would raise an eyebrow. Okay, oh, that's a good show. Is it? I'll listen. I'm looking for a new podcast, I'll listen to it. But I've pushed this on people who aren't naturally academic. I said, honestly, honestly, you'd love it. So I don't think it's elitist, you know. Yeah, I mean, I still in fact it's the anti-elitist elitist show, if that makes sense, you know.
SPEAKER_01Felix, thank you so much for speaking with me today.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's been such a pleasure. Honestly, how wonderful to be able to ramble on about my favorite podcast.
SPEAKER_01And that's the show. Podactually is produced and hosted by me, Katherine Harris. If you like the program, please tell a friend. And you can also support us over at Patreon at Pod Actually or on Substat. Thanks for listening. See you soon.
